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Ars Technica » Ars OpenForum 2.0a » Ars Technica News & Discussion » The latest scumware tactic: shades of 1999 PreviousGo to the next oldest topic in this forum Go to the next newest topic in this forumNext
Author Topic:   The latest scumware tactic: shades of 1999
Hannibal
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It seems like file-sharing programs are getting more and more unscrupulous about the ways in which they modify your computer when you install one of them. The past year has seen a spate of stories about the kinds of programs these applications surreptitiously install on users' machines in an attempt to generate revenue for the file-sharing company. The latest move in the race to the bottom is a new tactic employed by file-sharing programs like Kaaza and Morpheus: stealing referral commissions from the affiliates of online vendors like Amazon.

Amazon's affiliates program pays affiliated websites a commission each time a user clicks through from the affiliate's site to Amazon and buys something. An affiliate code is embedded into the referring URL, and Amazon uses this code to identify the referring affiliate so that it can correctly distribute the sales commission if that referral generates a sale. What these new scumware viruses/programs do is replace that affiliate code with their own code anytime an infected user clicks an affiliate link, so that the file-sharing company gets credit for the sale instead of the website that actually referred the customer. This is low.

These jerks claim that since their EULA notifies the user of the practice, it's all legal and on the up-and-up. The problem is that it's not the user that they're stealing from; it's the affiliate, who hasn't agreed to the EULA and most certainly has not agreed to have his referrals hijacked. I think that the people who cook this sort of stuff up and then have the gall to try and defend it as "legal" and legit should be tarred and feathered, or placed in the stocks, or subjected to some other form of public humiliation. Maybe we could put them on one of those crazy Japanese game shows, where they make you drink lots of Coke and then sit in a vat of freezing water, and if you have to get out and go to the bathroom they hook up jumper cables to your nipples and shock you repeatedly while the audience laughs at you. Anyway, if they'll try something like this, what's to stop them from hijacking banner click-throughs and siphoning ad revenues from everyone? Is Paypal theft on the roadmap for the next release, too?

In closing, I'll leave you with some comments on this quote from the opening of the article:

Some popular online services are using a new kind of software to divert sales commissions that would otherwise be paid to small online merchants by big sites like Amazon and eToys.

I don't know where this writer has been for the past year, but eToys isn't going to be paying commissions to anyone--they've thankfully gone bye-bye. That was one site I was glad to see gone, exemplifying as they did much of the arrogance that ultimately undid the dot-com era. It's this same sort of arrogance, which seems to stem from the insane notion that you have a God-given right to make money any way you can, even if it means taking something that isn't yours as long as you're not violating the letter of the law, that lies behind scumware like these referral-stealing programs. I'll be glad when these companies go the way of eToys, and I have no doubt that they eventually will.

kickboxer
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What a sad day this is. I guess I should have expected it though.

Being someone who hates spyware/adware with a burning passion, this just makes me shake my head while looking at the floor.
takes12no1
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Is it really suprising that a company whoose very existance depends on rampant piracy and low moral standards of many netizens would sink to this level. You can't swim with sharks and not expect to get bit.
Magoo
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Seeing the potentially dubious legality of P2P file sharing programs in the first place, it sickens but does not surprise me that the people behind some of these programs would be morally bankrupt.
Ensomnea
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Sounds exactly like the Enron/Worldcom crap that has been going around. What really makes me sad about this is people like these CEOs tie immoral and illegal as one and the same. The "I didn't break the law so did nothing wrong" irks me.
Gojulas
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Me thinks the average Kaaza user (and I'm thinking of the thousands of college freshmen who clog our network with filesharing) won't give a shit. As long as the... the... WTF would you call this? Exploit? As long as the exploit doesn't take money from THEM they will have no problem with it taking money from someone else. After all, they are.
zAmboni
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

Aaaaaah....
I thought I remembered something similar to this. Finally found it after searching.

Wrote a news post about it...
Wanna read it...
Here it goes...

Morpheus hijacks web addresses
Neitsdelf
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Enron : Off-Balance Sheet-Partnership :: Kaaza : Off-Web Page-Partnership ... with Satan!
guest
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

Will Ad-aware remove the parts responsible for the interceptions?
Fluogen
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/me thinks of writing a note to CNS thanking them for blocking these programs last year
John S
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

The two question that come to mind are: does Kazaalite take care of this problem? and how would one go about getting rid of it once they've been infected?
casper ghost
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quote:
Originally posted by guest:
Will Ad-aware remove the parts responsible for the interceptions?


Try Spybot - Search & Destroy. I like it much better than Ad-aware -- faster and w/ more features (and it's freeware too).
KDogg
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

What would really be nice here is if Amazon.com and others cancel Morpheous, Kazaa, Limewire, etc.'s payments from referrals. I know that may be wishful thinking. I think if Dante was around there would be an entire new level of Hell just for spyware authors and spammers. It certainly would be near the bottom.

-K
gioppe
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

I wonder if I was one of those programmers working at Kazaa/Morpheus... would I find my task immoral and stop coding?
arsbernard
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

casper ghost

Will Spybot definitely remove the parts responsible for interception?
casper ghost
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quote:
Originally posted by arsbernard:
Will Spybot definitely remove the parts responsible for interception?


Yes.

Try it, if you haven't run a spyware removal app recently you'll be really surprised at all the crap it picks up. It's really good at killing ad cookies that track you across multiple websites too. It also detects registry keys that contain recent-file lists for various programs and activity logs (they're deselected by default since in general you wouldn't care about something like WMP's recent media list -- unless you'd like to keep it from other users of the computer wink).

It allows you to easily rollback any changes it's made as well (though I've never needed to do that).

You can find a decent review of it here.

[EDIT: BTW, don't bother with Kaaza and Morpheus, try WinMX (it's become much more automated w/ v3.3).]

[This message was edited by casper ghost on September 27, 2002 at 15:21.]
Ator
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

quote:
Originally posted by takes12no1:
Is it really suprising that a company whoose very existance depends on rampant piracy and low moral standards of many netizens would sink to this level. You can't swim with sharks and not expect to get bit.


If you think that this sort of behavior is going to be limited to programs of questionable legality, you're living in a dream world. What is one of the most prominent spyware programs on the 'net? A stupid purple ape that cavorts around your screen. Just because these people thought of it first doesn't mean it won't spread to other downloadables.
chewie777
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I find the outrage over the 'theft' of affiliate revenues ironic indeed.

You could just as easily take (almost) any argument for file sharing and apply it to the above practice.
EtherMage
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

quote:
I don't know where this writer has been for the past year, but eToys isn't going to be paying commissions to anyone--they've thankfully gone bye-bye.


I don't know about anyone else, but when I went to http://www.etoys.com/ today, it looked alive and well. Has another company bought the name, or what?

-EtherMage
Hannibal
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quote:
I don't know about anyone else, but when I went to http://www.etoys.com/ today, it looked alive and well. Has another company bought the name, or what?


That's crazy. When I checked the site before I posted it, it was down. And I recall reading that they went bankrupt and had gone out of business. Hmm... perhaps someone else bought the domain?

Edit: Ahh... if you look at the bottom of the page, the copyright is KB Holdings, Inc. I presume this is KB Toys. Check here for more details: http://www.etoys.com/help/aboutus.html?style=default&place=ajrp
Fluogen
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

They were bought and restarted almost a year ago. They are now owned by KB Toys.
radagast
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Big, Little, and sizes of thieves inbetween......

Can't see why their users would object. Much of the software being used is for purposes of theft in the first place.

(ducks, but doesn't run or hide)

Think about it. I use your software to steal some software or a movie I don't have to pay for. Why shouldn't I let you "steal" a referal, click through adv. commissions or a 5 buck referral to PayPal that "belongs" to someone else?

Everyone knows the names of the big thieves who ruled Enron, Worldcom, et al. This software being used is by the little thieves among us. If they start stealing PayPal passwords or credit card numbers next, isn't that still pretty much thieves stealing from thieves?

Since when is there something wrong with that in recent years?

Sorry, Hannibal, I think the whole concept is a great idea. Next thing you know we'll have the Movie and Recording Industries pushing through an amendment to the DMCA allowing such software to include special little ferrets (sort of an improved form of worm). These ferrets will search hard drives for unencrypted text strings of 16 numbers in length which represent Visa and AmEX CC numbers.

(And lawyers will no longer be the only ones thought of as ferrets!)

Think of the fun. Before long the thieves will be stealing from the thieves who are stealing from the thieves who stole from the thieves.

(Is there one too many "thieves" in there? No matter). big grin
Sohcan
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quote:
Can't see why their users would object. Much of the software being used is for purposes of theft in the first place.

(ducks, but doesn't run or hide)

Think about it. I use your software to steal some software or a movie I don't have to pay for. Why shouldn't I let you "steal" a referal, click through adv. commissions or a 5 buck referral to PayPal that "belongs" to someone else?



You've missed the point...the file-sharing programs are not stealing from their users, but rather the affiliates to which the users think they are donating money. It is as if someone intends to donate money to a charity through Amazon, but because that person has Kazaa installed on his/her system, the money actually gets routed to Kazaa instead. Either way he/she is giving away money, but the charity did not agree to the EULA that enables Kazaa to take their proceeds.

It would be sweet irony if Kazaa was stealing money from their users, but they are actually stealing money from third-parties that are in no way associated with their file-swapping software.
SickOfItAll
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Use Kazaalite!

Removes all the bs and leaves you with the good stuff:

Get it here
Vader
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Great, now the RIAA will have even more "look at how evil these file-sharing companies are" ammunition. Not that the record companies they represent have ever ripped anyone off or anything. roll eyes

Vader
Raveus
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quote:
Originally posted by Hannibal:
quote:
I don't know about anyone else, but when I went to http://www.etoys.com/ today, it looked alive and well. Has another company bought the name, or what?


That's crazy. When I checked the site before I posted it, it was down. And I recall reading that they went bankrupt and had gone out of business. Hmm... perhaps someone else bought the domain?

Edit: Ahh... if you look at the bottom of the page, the copyright is KB Holdings, Inc. I presume this is KB Toys. Check here for more details: http://www.etoys.com/help/aboutus.html?style=default&place=ajrp


Amusingly enough, I didn't know this either until I clicked the link in the news blurb out of sheer... well, for some reason it just needed to be clicked :P Random hyperlinks can be funny that way. I was rather suprised; truth to tell I was expecting a dead link.

eToys affiliate program: http://www.etoys.com/affiliates/index.html?place=ahps
and, from the FAQ: When did eToys re-open?

Just in case you wanted some more info and didn't want to bother digging.

· Raveus
Elwood P Dowd
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

Y'all seem to be missing one interesting point...

We all know it's trivial programming to do this kind of scum move. But really interesting is that, believe it or not, they've shown some restraint: It would be equally easy to put a affiliate tag on *every* visit to one of these sites. That way, if the user goes to amazon by typing in the address, or by clicking on a non-affiliate link, the scumware would still make the money.

This would, of course, cost them no extra time programming. So, try to imagine why they aren't doing it:

Then they'd be stealing from Amazon, or whomever gives them their affiliation. Amazon would immediately close their account. Amazon should close their accounts now. Amazon should run a constantly updated Kazaa client, find out what referral tags it'd be using, and keep closing any account that the scumware refers to.
FilthRags
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posted   Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete Message

The latest scumware tactic: shades of 1999 - "What do we expect?"

Hey everyone...

I don't really like file sharing P2P stuff all that much. Nine times out of ten you get viruses and fake stuff sent to you and the speed sucks. But then again, I hate being F@#*ed over from the Industries too... Anyway, let's face the truth here... All of us who use these file sharing programs are *BREAKING THE LAW ANYWAY*... Why is anyone even remotely surprised that a mob that writes a program to blatently PIRATE software and digital media is going to try and intercept this code so they can get the commission... Christ, it's like you all seem to think the sun shines out their butts! Wake up people, all of us who use KaZaA are commiting offences against the law we expect to protect us when the time comes. Personally, I don't agree with the interception, but let me ask you all this; If you were a software developer working years to develop a game or a useful utility that could end up being your ticket to a happy life and wealth, wouldn't you be pissed off if 6 million or so cohorts used KaZaA to download a cracked copy of your program that you recieve no money for.
Take a look in the mirror before being so damned judgemental. And...

IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, STOP INSTALLING KAZAA AND STEALING SOFTWARE!

There, now I'm done. hehe big grin

Cheers all.
Rags.rags@pacific.net.au
JustinS
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Are the people defending this practice really incapable of understanding that it's not the home user who is getting monetarily ripped off?
WaltC
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Possibly something good may come of this for EULAs

I can see how this might make a great case for getting across the concept that just because a software company writes something in a license doesn't make it legal or binding. Software companies are not legislatures--they have no power to legislate. If a provision within a EULA violates existing Federal law or state law in the state where the EULA is written (at least) then the provision of the EULA is automatically null and void.

It's just like a contract--even though they are signed and voluntarily agreed to, if the terms are illegal the contract is null and void.

In this case in particular it strikes me that the injured parties are the ones from whom the commissions were stolen--the end users obviously were not involved and even if they read their EULAs and assented they have no authority to bargain away the commissions of other companies, so it strikes me that a EULA defense for the scumware providers is utterly vacuous. The aggrieved companies will have no trouble establishing damages. I'm wondering what other laws were broken as the guilty parties have readily admitted to it without so much as a qualm.

This illustrates well the problem I have always had with EULAs in general--that they do not offer full disclosure for the end user in an abbreviated summary. All kinds of contracts depend on disclosure which takes place *before* the contract is considered binding--contracts can be nullified by proof that disclosure never took place, in fact. EULAs suck, in other words, and what an irony it would be if it takes the scumware (what a great word) companies to bring the entire concept of EULAs to heel and get some much needed basics concerning customer disclosure *up front* established for this regrettable practice.
poptones
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Acting illegally . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Acting Immoraly.

There can be a wide gulf between those two. If these clients were stealing credit card numbers from the machines they're installed on I'd have far less objection than I have to what they are doing now.

And if you're a programmer spending siux years working on a game and you don't want to see anyone rip it off and trade it on usenet, stop wasting your time developing for the PC and work on X-box or PS2 games. There ARE alternatives; employ them to your advantage or else just shut the fuck up and wake up to the fact US law never promised anyone payment for every use of a published work.

I don't like these commercial p2p networks either - never did. But I do value free expression as well as freedom to obtain information - even 'tho our wonderful constitution still came up remarkably short-sighted on that particular point.

So what's to do? Well, it seems one avenue might be for all those affiliates to raise a stink with their "partners." Ironic, 'tho, Amazon.com started in the business of selling books - information - and the position these "partners" now find themselves in is very similar to that of all copyright holders: they're able to collect fees for some referrals, but not all.

There's beauty in nature, even if it's sometimes hard to find.
WaltC
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quote:
Originally posted by poptones:

I don't like these commercial p2p networks either - never did. But I do value free expression as well as freedom _to obtain_ information - even 'tho our wonderful constitution still came up remarkably short-sighted on that particular point.





I would only add here that I don't think it's the Constitution that's been short-sighted. I think it's the judges and lawyers who interpret the Constitution who are responsible for any short-sightedness in its application. Let's all just hope that the moral fiber of the country doesn't degenerate to the degree that the Constitution becomes little more than a symbolic facade, with the politicians, lawyers, and judges hiding a sea of corruption behind it.

Things like this scumware deal bother me enormously. It's even more disturbing to think that nothing might be done about it.

EDIT: 30 years ago what the scumware people have done here would have been called fraud. Today it's called a EULA. Unbelievable.
ibous
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LOL

Gaaaaaawd I love the internet. I don't know why I find this funny but a lot of the responses to this article make me laugh because to some level it's like the people posting don't know what's up with the web at all! Don't get me wrong I really think this whole thing really stinks but you know what all I can think to say right now is welcome "out of utopia".
andyfatbastard
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http://www.gnucleus.com/ - an open source Gnutella program.

Also, I have found WinMX to be completely scum free. The software that is, not the users.
Jeppe Utzon
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quote:
gioppe: I wonder if I was one of those programmers working at Kazaa/Morpheus... would I find my task immoral and stop coding?


People are still working for Microsoft....
jxl
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I wasn't aware that Microsoft was (figuratively) ripping pennies from the hands of orphans?
+4: Funny on Slashdot falls flat everywhere else, champ.

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